Stay classy, haters.

This is what passes for discourse on the right, concerning the Cordoba community centre at Park 51, Lower Manhattan:

burn-it-down.jpg

Thanks to a little birdie on the tweeter who spotted this.

And no, I’m not going to conceal any of those names. They felt they could post this publicly, so more publicity they and their insanity shall get.

FBI, consider this a heads-up. NYPD, same goes for you. Do your duty, coppers.

PS: That guy who says he did it before? Maybe this was his handiwork. Srsly, FBI, read Facebook. Innocent people’s lives are depending on you, and this is better intel than you’d get through waterboarding.

UPDATE: It now appears that shots were also fired near the site this afternoon. Yeah, this shit is serious.

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This entry was posted in Fascism Without Swastikas, Fine Young Cannibals, Isn't That Illegal?, Not So Compassionate Conservatism, Sick Frickin' Bastards, The Hardcore Stupid. Bookmark the permalink.

47 Responses to Stay classy, haters.

  1. Panfruit says:

    That is just complete insanity. 🙁

  2. Slave Revolt says:

    Remember my displacement of collective guilt and projection theory with respect to the ‘terror GZ mosque’.
    Well, don’t try saying it to people in public.
    I was attacked by a deranged redneck at a gas station.
    However, I am unscathed–when the deranged red-neck lunged at a black dude pumping gas nearby, and my Puerto Rican-American bro factored into this deranged guy’s calculations, he thought better of murdering me.
    I am seriously starting to believe that there is a ‘stupid gene’ that plays a part of the collective suicidal and ecocidal trajectory that we are enmeshed within.
    The collective guilt-by-association meme is seriously freaky. Smells of the death-camp. The fact that many ‘educated’ folk engage this shit tells a thinking person something.
    Anyway, thank dog for Mayor Bloomberg displaying real courage. Being on the right-side of history is important for this man.
    And, Bina, why are the progressive-left so inept at organizing for stuff like single-payer healthcare, and other issues? Many like to point fingers, with sound arguments, but they don’t get off the couch. This tendency is rife, and it is part of the Matrix of modern crapitalism.
    Marcuse and Adorno described this in their pessimistic analysis decades ago.
    I think that my hopes reside in indigenous communities and the ‘third world’ movements. For sure, though, this vile system is unravelling–as anyone with a brain can see.
    Best regards, Bina. I’ve been busy so my commenting here is sparse. More, I felt bad about using the adjective ‘priggish’ with respect to the baby bong issue. No hate or disrespect intended. However, if I say something that is off-putting, I would expect you to be honest in your response.
    Compadres don’t blow smoke up each other’s asses. (Err…not that there is anything wrong with that, among two consenting adults. Just covering my ass in case there are folks that engage such activity : )

  3. Not a problem here, and no hard feelings held…I just don’t like people smoking up in front of their kids or leaving the paraphernalia around where they can find it. Let the little ones grow up, let their frontal lobes mature, and let ’em acquire some reasoning skills, before they’re exposed to stuff that can affect their growing brains. I didn’t try pot until I was well past 25, and if I hadn’t been in a car accident at 14 (and exposed to the dangers of hospital narcotics), I probably wouldn’t have tried hard drugs either. (Demerol = heroin, as far as side effects and addictiveness go. Also, it is scary shit.)
    Mostly, though, I regard drugs as medicine–to be used with care and a sense of purpose, not just toyed around with.
    And yeah, these assholes you talked about are the real enemy. There is no reasoning with them when they’re in this excited, blood-crazed state. They are deranged, whether by nature, by meth, or by crapaganda or all of the above. They need to be locked up where there are no guns and no sharp objects, and weaned off whatever it is that’s eating them. And if they’re still not well by then, they need to stay locked up, so they don’t hurt anyone else.
    As to where the progressive left in the US is on this issue, I’d say the people easily know what’s needed and they’re not silent about it, but the politicians and pundits are all in the pocket of the corporations. Michael Moore did a great job with Sicko, exposing how they got bought off the last time around, when Hillary Clinton nearly did the (now, sadly) unthinkable. Until someone locks up the corporate psychos along with the garden-variety street nuts, and brings in strict regulations, and cuts corporate cash out of Washington’s workings, it’s just never going to change.

  4. Slave Revolt says:

    Indeed, this woman was too blasé leaving bongs around and even smoking in front of kids.
    Note to parents: if kids get mad, they will and can narc your ass out. Word.
    And, you see, that’s why I don’t have kids
    ; )

  5. LOL! And of course, societal insanity. Poor kids are gonna need drugs, at the rate things are going, although it won’t help them cope with the madness for long.

  6. Seriously says:

    Seriously, I CAN’T understand why you guys think the building of this Mosque is OK at this particular site. I don’t care if they build the Mosque, just not there. I don’t think it should be burned down, but seriously, like it or not, the twin towers were destroyed in the name is Islam. It doesn’t matter if it’s a small minority of the religion or not. It would be like someone building a memorial to Eric Harris and Dylan Kleibold next door to Columbine. It’s downright disrespectful to the thousands of American’s that lost their lives that day. How many of you know someone who died that day? And no, your step-mom’s third cousin twice removed does NOT count as knowing someone. My best friend for 25 years died in those buildings. He was MURDERED in the name of Islam and yet you think it is OK for a Mosque to be built at that particular site? Come on now. You have to be sick or downright mean-spirited to let this happen.

  7. Oh really? Let’s take this argument apart and see how much of it actually passes the sniff test.
    First off, you obviously have a poor grip on the nature of what you’re dealing with here. It’s not a mosque, it’s a community centre. It happens to be a Muslim one, yes. But it won’t have minarets, and it will have a gym and a swimming pool. Mosques don’t have swimming pools.
    Secondly, it won’t be AT Ground Zero. It won’t even be within a direct line of sight from the site. It will be at least two city blocks away. So it’s not as if it’s being built on your alleged friend’s ashes. Besides which, the debris from the WTC site is in a LANDFILL. Including whatever’s left of your friend, if you really had one involved. (Personally I’m skeptical of any anonymous troll who sanctimoniously claims they had a friend in there if they don’t name names or give any details I can independently verify. And even if what you say about him IS true, it still doesn’t give your argument any additional weight.)
    Thirdly, if you’re gonna talk about disrespect to the dead, look at all the strip clubs, adult-video shops, and sex shops that are within the same radius of the site. Are you telling me those have more of a right to be there than a family-oriented community centre where non-Muslims are also welcome? Why are THEY not a desecration of that hallowed ground? The Pentagon was also hit, and there’s a Muslim prayer room in it to this day; it was there BEFORE 9-11. I don’t hear you screaming about that. Is the Pentagon not also hallowed 9-11 ground? Why is nobody demanding that all Muslims be kicked out of there, at least for the sake of consistency?
    Fourth, 9-11 did NOT happen in the name of Islam. If I were a Muslim looking to convert people to my religion, I don’t think I’d seriously expect them to become truly faithful and devout just out of fear of what some pipsqueak with a box cutter could do to them and their buildings. This was not ever about religion. Look at the target–it wasn’t a church, it wasn’t a synagogue, it wasn’t a Hindu temple, it was a capitalist office tower! This was backlash against an empire, not jihad. And the fact that the hijackers visited strip clubs and drank alcohol the night before they did their deed is also far out of character for any real Muslim with an eye to dying for his faith. Terrorist strikes are political by nature, no matter what the terrorists themselves may believe. And true believers of any faith strongly repudiate terrorism done in their name. Islam is no exception.
    Fifth, WHAT memorial to the terrorists? Your Columbine analogy stinks to high heaven. Nobody even remotely proposed a monument to the 19 criminals who hijacked those planes. You’d have to be crazy to think this has anything to do with them. The imam overseeing the project is a Sufi. He comes from the most peaceful branch of Islam, and the one most opposed to the twisted heresies of the hijackers. No, “those people” are NOT all alike! Surprise!
    Sixth, there are over 250 9-11 victim/survivor families who disagree with you, and these come from all walks of life. They understand that the US is a pluralistic country, one with room for everyone. Muslim workers in the WTC died on 9-11 too; why shouldn’t their families and friends have a place of solace within walking distance, and one that is not even within a direct line of sight? Seems kind of mean-spirited to deny them THAT, don’t you think?
    And finally, Muslims have been in North America for almost as long as white people have. The first one was Dutch and arrived in what’s now New York in the 1600s. If they had really wanted to take the country over in the name of Islam, they had 400 years in which to do it. And did they? NO. So why fear them now? And why burn down their places of worship, or even oppose the building of them?
    As much as it may shock you to learn this, NOTHING really changed on 9-11. The world’s 1.5 billion Muslims are still as uninterested in forcing you to convert as they were the day before. They are still just as content to live and let live. If they can extend that basic respect to you, why can’t you reciprocate? You’ve had nine whole years to think, get a grip on this and to learn the facts, and you’re still ignorant and still holding a grudge? That’s pretty “sick and mean-spirited” on your own part.

  8. Seriously says:

    Point 1: If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, it’s a duck. Call it by any other name, but it still has a Mosque, albeit with a swimming pool. I know of plenty of churches around here that have swimming pools (one in fact has a “lazy-river”) and don’t hide behind other titles.
    Second, I’m glad I get to see your true colors. I’ve followed you for awhile and never commented until I disagreed with you, but how dare you refer to my “alleged” friends ashes. His name was Joe Klares and he was 10x the human that you will ever be.
    Third, sure strip clubs and sex shops are also a disgrace, however, they did not kill Joe. It was a group of radical MUSLIMS. If it had been porn fiends who did it, I would protest that too. Sure, there is a Muslim prayer room at the Pentagon, but as you said, IT WAS THERE BEFORE THE ATTACKS. I’m not asking NYC to remove anything that is already in place. I’m not asking Muslims to be kicked out of anywhere. They’re not even there right now. I’m just asking them to have some respect and build their “Community Center” elsewhere.
    Fourth, be that as it may, they were still Muslim and claimed to do it in the name of Allah. Look it up, it’s no secret. Al Qaeda has strong ties with Islam. To argue that is ridiculous.
    Fifth, maybe it’s not the greatest argument, but I suggest you read the Qu’ran and tell me what it says. I’ve done it, and the Qu’ran specifically states within it’s writings that if there are any contradictions throughout the text, that the “Passages written at the latest date shall supercede all others written before it”. Read the end of the Qu’ran, that’s all you’ll need to see.
    250 families? Define that number. If my brother died, and I’m for the “Community Center” being built, but his wife, children, parents, etc… agree with me, does that make my “FAMILY” as one who disagrees? Even so, that’s less than 10%. Sorry, not a good argument, and no I do not feeel that it is “mean-spirited” to deny them that. You, like me, are liberal. You should understand that society as a whole should benefit, not just the few Muslim families that were also affected. THE BUILDING HASN’T EVEN BEEN BUILT YET.
    Lastly, I think it’s ridiculous you’re comparing Muslims and “White-People”. I wasn’t aware that race and religion were mutually exclusive. So if I’m Christian, does that mean that African-Americans cannot also be? I’m not saying get rid of Muslims, nor am I condoning burning down a Mosque. I’m simply asking them not to build there. It’s not a difficult request. Furthermore, this country and it’s government were based on Christianity, although they did believe in Freedom of Religion. Look it up, many of the most influential writers of the Constitution were KNOWN Christians. So no, it doesn’t surprise me that the

  9. Tom, disagreeing with me doesn’t make you ignorant; being ignorant makes you ignorant. And you are WILFULLY ignorant. That’s your problem, not mine. Your “duck” argument is a load of quackery.
    I don’t know Joe, but his name is apparently on the list of victims, so there’s one small point in your favor. (I’m sorry about him, BTW.) But it still doesn’t make you right. And it still doesn’t give you the right to tell other people where they can build what.
    And thanks for the abuse. You’re now banned. I don’t care if I never hear from you again, since I never heard from you before and I am frankly sickened by anyone who sides, even slightly, with a bunch of wingnut vandals who want to burn other people’s buildings. If you believe you live in a free country, you will have to accept and live alongside people who don’t agree with YOU. And you don’t get to tar them all as terrorists just because you don’t like their religion.

  10. Seriously says:

    I win so I get banned. If all of lifes problems were just this easy. Fairwell.

  11. All right, you got your third strike in, buy capitalizing your Gmail address. Very cute. But three strikes means you’re out, not “you win”. Your emotionalistic breast-beating lost you the argument, and if you can’t face it (or spell Farewell), that’s not my fault either.

  12. Brian says:

    Haha nice banter. You spelled (by) wrong just FYI =X. Don’t ban me

  13. I don’t take orders from illiterates, Brian or Bud or whatever your real name is.
    BYE.

  14. Brian says:

    I’m illiterate because you said “buy capitalizing your Gmail address”. Yes, you’re right. I’m the illiterate one. Way to not post Wes’s response to your “cute, little rant”. It just shows what a coward you are.

  15. You’re a fucking idiot for quibbling over a minor typo, and so’s your wussy pal “Wes”, for posting his little tutorial about my bad fucking language on the WRONG FUCKING ENTRY.
    Are any of you trolling arbiters of class going to address the problem of arsonists among your own, or are you just going to snipe at me? Because if you are, I’m going to ban all of you. I don’t give a damn what you bigoted fucking scumbags “think” (note quotation marks), and I don’t have enough hours in the day to blow sugar up your candy asses.

  16. Brian says:

    Hahahahaha… “You’re a fucking idiot for quibbling over a minor typo”….
    Three posts ago “…and if you can’t face it (or spell Farewell), that’s not my fault either…”
    Wow… And you expect us not to believe you’re a hypocrite? You’re just another liberal hippy douche on your high horse begging for someone in the world to listen to you. Fuck Islam and Fuck Allah… Send that to the FBI and see if they don’t laugh at you… I’m sure the FBI really cares about people who don’t like Islam… Idiot…

  17. Hey, at least I know the difference between a slip of the fingers and a lapse of the brain. You, on the other hand…
    And who’s begging? I didn’t even fucking invite any of you. You came under your own steam, and from now on, nothing any of you whiny little right-wing bitches write is coming through. Except to FBI headquarters, to whom all the confirmation e-mails will henceforth be forwarded. Headers and IP numbers and all.
    Now go fuck yourself. It’s likely to be the only intimate contact you’ll get for a long time.

  18. Brian says:

    I seriously doubt the FBI cares about a bunch of people who don’t like Islam, but don’t really go out of their way to do shit about it… I do HOWEVER believe that they care about a socialist piece of shit like yourself standing on your soap box shouting about how every conservative policy in the United States is an abomination… You are so far left it’s ridiculous… Extremes are NEVER good, and you yourself are an extremist… FYI I’m married so intimate contact isn’t really an issue, but unless you’re married to a deaf person, God only knows you’ll never be laid because no one would want to listen to your constant bullshit that spews between your lips (no pun intended)… Seriously send this message to the FBI.. and be sure to send me a return receipt please… And if they respond with something like “Ma’am… Please shut your twat.” I would like that e-mail too. K, thanks.
    P.S. You’re Canadian so stay the fuck up North and don’t fucking worry about what we do down here since it has no affect on YOU. FUCK OFF.

  19. LOL! That’s the funniest thing I’ve read all day. Ever hear that old adage, “The higher a monkey climbs, the more he shows his ass”? Well, you’re the monkey. Care for a banana? (No, wait, I know exactly where you’ll put it. Ew.)
    BTW, your buddy Wes wrote back, all apologetic. Care to copy his more civil example, or do you want to go on making a monkey’s ass of yourself? Choice is yours, bud.
    And no, the FBI doesn’t care what *I* do. J. Edgar’s death has changed a lot of things around there, so sorry to disappoint you. I’ve managed to travel to and from the US on more than one occasion since 9-11 without so much as a hard questioning. Even my lethal laptop didn’t get searched. Gee, you’d think that a left-wing “extremist” (which I am not) would get more flak!
    You’re also wrong about Canada. Our WORST people are carbon copies of the likes of you, and there are more of them lately, thanks to our crappy PM and his monkey-see-monkey-do policymaking. He’s Republican Lite. Thanks a pantload for that.
    And if ever I’m in Lower Manhattan after Park 51 is built, I’m going to drop in for a visit. It will be open to the public, and that just seems like the civilized thing to do.
    Now skedaddle, unless you wanna be flushed, you little turd.

  20. Brian says:

    I actually don’t think they give a fuck about you either, but they sure as hell don’t care about you sennding them a shit-ton of e-mails about people not liking Islam. Do you actually think they care? Do you actually think they like Islam? Please.
    Stil waiting on that E-mail from the FBI.
    Come On you have my IP and my E-mail. Let’s get on with this tattling already. I think when I get home from work I’ll call my mom and tell her what an asshole you are. That’ll show you!
    GFY – Thanks!

  21. Keep climbing, monkey. You show your ass so well. In fact, you’re doing my job for me. Congrats!
    PS: It doesn’t matter who the FBI “likes”. It matters that they prevent CRIME. You know, like what the haters above (stay classy, Brian) are promising to do?
    PPS: Nice use of an alternative e-mail address, Tom Thompson IV:
    Commenter name: Brian
    Commenter email address: BudS6565@AOL.com
    Commenter URL:
    Commenter IP address: 70.124.121.61
    Commenter name: Seriously
    Commenter email address: TomThompsonIV@gmail.com
    Commenter URL:
    Commenter IP address: 70.124.121.61
    Notice any similarities there in the IP number? Wow, what a classy way to remember your dead friend…by coming back under a fake identity. Tom/Brian, you are one sick puppy.

  22. Brian says:

    *Gasp* You mean one computer = one IP address? Gee, maybe you never thought that Tom and I might be coworkers under the same network (you know, because all computers at businesses are under a network, same dynamic IP), and that maybe, JUST MAYBE, he told me about your little blog here. WOW! WHAT A CONCEPT. You’re such twat. Way to jump to conclusions there. Seriously your IQ must be 12.
    GFY again and try to come up with some other way to discredit me.

  23. Ha! Like I believe that. You talk like a moron who’s got nothing better to do than play with himself all day long.
    Well, assuming what you say is true, I’m sure your employer appreciates your use of company time and computers to heap abuse on random strangers. Especially in this lovely economic climate. Your ISP does too, I’m sure. RR.com is RoadRunner, if I’m not mistaken. And you’re in Texas? Surprise, surprise.
    Well, adios. Nice hearing from you. Always good to know how far you trolls will go for a laugh at your own expense.

  24. Anthony says:

    Wow, post an article about Facebook Freepers threatening to recreate Kristallnacht, and they all come crawling out of the sewers and regurgitate/copy-paste Nazi propaganda from Free Republic and/or Stormfront. Again, I wonder how many of these far-right extremists are in that pro-terrorist “Lord, Kill Obama” page on Facebook, coming in here to spew their bile just because someone is showing the world their very words.
    Honestly, Seriously/Tom/Brian/whatthefuckyourrealnameis, if you really were friends with Joe Klares (not just randomly namedropping someone who was killed on 9/11), I don’t think going into left-blogs screaming “You dirty socialist liberals!!!11one” would be a great way to honor his memory.
    Funny how the right-wingers scream that a Muslim community center two blocks from Ground Zero is built on “hallowed ground”, but they don’t complain when this pedophilic Satanic demon Fred Phelps sets his jackboots *on Ground Zero* and claims that everyone killed on 9/11 “was sent to Hell” – what do you think about that, Freepers? “Oh, but he’s a good Christian, not a Moslem. That puts him in our good book.” Oh, how I hate…how I *LOATHE* U.S. far-right hypocrisy.

  25. Anthony, tell us how you really feel. LOL.
    But seriously: If anyone doubts that this kind of talk is ugly shit, just switch out the word “Muslim” for “Jew”, and “mosque” for “synagogue”. THAT is the kind of perspective you need to view this situation accurately.

  26. Anthony (not Donaldson) says:

    Oh, let’s just say that I could power China for centuries with the kind of hate I feel for the U.S. far-right. 🙂

  27. You ‘n’ me both, amigo. Too bad what we got can’t be bottled, it would probably solve the renewable energy crisis nicely. LOL!

  28. Wren says:

    Oh! I finally get it. It’s kind of like what Lewis Black said on the Daily Show about Glenn Beck. It’s six degrees of Kevin Bacon only there is just one degree and Kevin Bacon is Al-Qaeda. Members of Cordoba House are American Muslim. Members of Al-Qaeda are radical Wahhabi Muslim. Therefor, those building at Park 51 are Al-Qaeda.
    Oh! Oh! Can I try now? Timothy McVeigh was Catholic. Timothy McVeigh was a terrorist that killed 168 people. Therefor, Catholics are terrorists. How about this: Hitler was Catholic. Hitler was a genocidal megalomaniac. Therefore, Catholics are genocidal megalomaniacs. Gee, this is easy. Thinking like a right-wing bigot sure is a lot less stressful than the rational thought I usually use.
    P.S. ‘Bina, you had one fact wrong in this “exchange” with your “interlocutor(s).” The prayer room in the Pentagon that Muslims use for prayer wasn’t there before the attacks of 9/11. It was built in 2002 and without one peep from anybody talking about hallowed ground or victory mosques.

  29. Brian says:

    “You ‘n’ me both, amigo. Too bad what we got can’t be bottled, it would probably solve the renewable energy crisis nicely. LOL!”
    I actually agree with this statement. Bullshit makes for great biofuel.
    I love how I’m far right for disagreeing with this one statement (and/or being from Texas). You people are as quick to judge as anyone I’ve ever met. You presume that because I don’t like Islam that I am a Christian? Did I say that? Ever? Maybe I dislike organized religion as a whole.
    “But seriously: If anyone doubts that this kind of talk is ugly shit, just switch out the word “Muslim” for “Jew”, and “mosque” for “synagogue”. THAT is the kind of perspective you need to view this situation accurately.”
    If a Jewish-affiliated terrorist group would’ve knocked over the WTC, I would oppose that building as well. You are so quick to assume that I am against the Mosque because it’s promoting the Muslim religion. Far from the truth. I’m opposed to building the Mosque because terrorists, claiming Islam knocked the building down in the first place. What if I had my best friend go knock down another house because I wanted to build a house on a certain piece of land. Sure I could pay for it, but I don’t think that would make the previous owners very happy, and I don’t think anyone would want me as a neighbor either no?
    As far as you banning my IP, I’ll just let you know I can get around that ALL day so you should probably quit that.

  30. I have a better idea, asshole…why don’t you quit harassing me? Because that’s what you’re doing. It’s called HARASSMENT, and it’s illegal. Look it up, you cyberstalking piece of shit.

  31. Brian says:

    I’m not harrassing, I’m responding. I have not threatened you, nor will I resort to such juvenile tactics.
    I simply want to have a discussion, and want to know why I’m being judged and deemed one way when I’m really not that way at all. You never let me explain my rationale, you simply leap to conclusions and yell at me and tell me I’m wrong. I think a little patience and tolerance in life would do you a lot of good.

  32. Oh, suddenly it’s a “discussion” you want, after freeping me and heaping me with lies, insults and sexist abuse? Did you hear that, everybody, the troll wants a “discussion”! I’m not tolerant enough toward racist, sexist, islamophobic bigots! I’m not tolerant enough of intolerant idiots with zero logic! Doesn’t that just make you want to cry?
    But seriously: What’s to discuss? This is bigotry, terroristm and hate crime you’re promoting, and there is nothing to discuss. Everything I need to know about you is already posted in the Facebook screencap above. And your previous comments don’t read like even remotely intelligent discussion, either. You have no shame, and no dignity, and no point to make at the bottom of it all, other than that you are a bigot and a loser who deserves no more of my time or energy here. I’ve wasted enough space on your asinine juvenilia already.

  33. Brian says:

    Fred Phelps is a twat too if that’s what you’re classifying as sexist abuse. The insults are common ground between us so don’t act like the victim here.
    I don’t condone Wes blowing anything up. That’s not my style. I don’t break the law, aside from a couple of speeding tickets. I just have the opinion that I prefer that mosque not be built there. If it is. Fine. I won’t like it but tough shit right? I’m not promoting hate crimes. I don’t hate Muslims, I hate organized religion. I’ve said this before, hate the game, not the player (or something like that). I wasn’t on that facebook screencap by the way, LOL although I see the confusion. I am not Brian Butler, go to your other post and ask Wes he’ll verify.
    I may have no shame, and obviously very little dignity, but I always have a point, and my point is don’t judge me when you don’t know me. You know nothing about me other than this small banter here. NOTHING. I don’t know why I’m a bigot, although the loser argument is becoming more and more apparent. I seriously just wish you would go back and read this, knowing that I’m not Brian Butler and see where I actually condoned the blowing up of the Mosque. You can’t and won’t find that. Don’t judge me, that’s what I’m asking.

  34. Who’s playing the victim here? YOU ARE. You came uninvited, you abused me like a drunken freeper, and suddenly now you want to “explain”? You should have done that a lot sooner and kept a civil tongue in your head from the start; you might not have wrecked your cred quite so badly.
    What understanding do you expect of me? You don’t get to make the NY city planning department’s decisions, so it’s out of your hands. And your flaming me out here doesn’t score you any points there. If you have a problem with Park 51, and you have a legitimate case to make, then you take it up with the appropriate authorities, not some innocent third-party blogger who decided to call a bunch of trolls out. Try understanding THAT.
    And frankly, your religious views or lack thereof are no interest of mine either. What is, is your apparent excuse-making for criminal threats. There is no excuse for that. I don’t owe your intolerance any tolerance of my own. Nor do I owe criminal threats, even facetious ones, any tolerance either. NOBODY OWES ANYBODY THAT.
    And based on how you’ve acted here, I can damn well judge you all I damn well please. I judge that you’ve acted very stupidly, and that it is extremely late in the game to undo the damage. If you’re wise, you’ll leave it there and be gone. I don’t owe you anything; got that?

  35. Anthony says:

    “Brian”, if you already “won” the argument, why do you still write here? Do you have a problem with people pointing out that the far-right wants to blow up the community center? I don’t hear you complaining about bombing their countries, or “building Ground Zero’s next to their mosques”.
    We already have one million civilian fatalities in Iraq, and millions of refugees in the neighboring countries and across Europe. Isn’t that enough humiliation, without telling the Islamic world that community centers are off-limits? You’re begging to “Don’t judge me, that’s what I’m asking”, after writing “You’re just another liberal hippy douche… Fuck Islam and Fuck Allah…” – how do you expect NOT to get judged!?
    Obviously, you have a MAJOR problem with someone pointing out that the U.S. far-right wants another Kristallnacht. You right-wingers LOVE to talk about personal responsibility – well, OWN IT! Own the comments from the Freepers about bombing the commmunity center! Don’t try and pin this on “liberal Obamaplants”, just gather some balls and own your far-right violence fantasies already.

  36. Brian says:

    I have nothing to explain to you. I’ve told you I really feel in response to you telling me how YOU think I feel. Same with the religion. You tell me what YOU perceive me as, and YOU are wrong and I am telling YOU that for that reason. I’m not complaining about the Mosque to you. I’m merely having a debate. To be honest, you started with the name calling, but I’ll be damned if I’m outdone in that department. I don’t personally care how you feel about Park 51, because similar to the fact that I can’t do anything against it, you can’t do anything for it. To be completely honest, if Park 51 has people like you defending it, I actually tend to think that does more harm than good. You are very hot-tempered and you are very pigheaded. I state again, I am NOT Brian Butler. I do NOT condone burning down Park 51 when/if it is build. I will NOT be a part of any group that acts violently against the construction. I will NOT condone those acts. You keep saying I’m making criminal threats, but I would like to know where. I reread my posts, and don’t see anywhere where I make a criminal threat. Once again, it’s the fact that you don’t even read what I have to say, you still assume I’m this guy, even though I say to you again I AM NOT BRIAN BUTLER. I’m not intolerant of Muslims. I could care less and agree that it is their right to practice Islam. I just think there should be boundaries. For example you can’t build a Japanese museum in Pearl Harbor. It’s just disrespectful to me.
    Also, I wouldn’t call those 4 extremists from Facebook “Trolls”. If anyone was trolling it would be whoever went and searched for facebook statuses concerning Mosque bombing. Again, I’m not Brian Butler, and I don’t condone bombing the Mosque.
    Also, feel free to judge me like I know you have been. I know you say you can, but that just makes you look foolish in my opinion. I’m not judging you. I think you are passionate just like I am. I think we have different views, but I guarantee you believe in many of the same things, however, you call me far right, which is far wrong. I seriously just wish you could get past your preconceived notion of myself and be a little more tolerant.

  37. Brian says:

    Anthony… Don’t start me on the Iraq war. We have yet to even mention that and yet you assume I was for the war? Come on man. You don’t even begin to know my opinion on the war. You assume I’m far right. Far from it. You judge because of ONE “right-leaning” opinion that I have yet you shove me to the far right. Maybe I’m a liberal hippy douche (South Park reference by the way, I was hoping someone would catch it, instead it worked against me). I said Fuck Islam and Fuck Allah ONLY to prove a point and that is that the FBI doesn’t care when people say shit like that. People say that all the time. I’ve mentioned my distaste for organized religion in past posts, yet you assume I single Islam out. I don’t. This is the problem I have. You’ve pegged me as far-right, pro-war and condoning the bombing of the Mosque, all of which are wrong and it’s you stereotyping me for having ONE belief. Come on man. You gotta understand there is more than just liberal and conservative. People can be a mix. Maybe you’re not, but maybe you are. Just know that I am and try not to jump to conclusions about me.

  38. Look, dude…when you lie down with dogs, you get up with fleas. When you line up with the far right, you can’t reasonably expect the left to embrace you. It’s as simple as that! I don’t make common cause with Nazis over Israel’s shitty treatment of Palestinians, and I don’t make common cause with gun nuts over jackbooted thuggery from cops, so why should I accept anyone as a leftist when his views on Park 51 are fully in line with those on the right? It’s called moral clarity–look into it sometime.
    And quit accusing me of jumping to conclusions I never jumped to. No one said you were Brian Butler. I don’t care if you’re Brian fucking Babylon! I accept that you did not appear in the excerpt, and I did not even once accuse you of being in it. But your refusal to condemn this kind of behavior still speaks badly of you. You instead went and defended the arson-mongers; doesn’t that tell you anything about yourself?

  39. Anthony says:

    Then why do you still refer to the community center as a “mosque”? But no, you just had to quote Eric Cartman, mascot of the present-day U.S. far-right. Though you’re right, there’s more than liberal and conservative. Which is why I’m to the left of liberal and not shutting up when you scream “You’re Canadian so stay the fuck up North – FUCK OFF”; honestly, shouting “Fuck off” when it’s not even your blog to begin with?
    Seriously, it’s way past work hours in Texas, so don’t try and fool us about being two different people sharing the same IP address.

  40. Brian fucking Babylon says:

    The problem Sabina is that, while there may be clear lines between right and left on a given issue, that one issue does not define a person’s political spectrum. In my case, not at all. Are you telling me you don’t have one conservative leaning opinion on ANYTHING at all? If so, then that does make you an extremist. Extremists, and they are far too common, are bad either way. They are people who let liberal or conservative agends affect how they think. I refuse to be that person. I make my own opinion be it in line with the right or left, and I personally feel you should too. I don’t expect the left or the right to embrace me. I don’t vote to appease one side or the other. I vote in what I feel makes this world better. The fact that a given side doesn’t embrace me means I am a free-thinker. It means I am an individualist with my own agenda. I understand the concept of moral clarity and actually tend to discredit it. I don’t feel that things are either black or white, grey exists for a reason. However, I do feel grey may lean one way or another and I do feel that, often times, one decision is better, and that’s usually how I plan my course of action. Again, I urge you to do the same.
    You did jump to conclusions and you did say that I appeared in the excerpt. Let me refresh your memory. “Everything I need to know about you is already posted in the Facebook screencap above.”
    As far as condemning that kind of behavior, I feel I’ve made it very clear that I don’t think that is the right course of action. It is reprehensible. Why would I defend something that I have stated numerous times I don’t condone. Again I think you should go back and read my previous statements where I have said countless times that I do not condone burning Mosques or any building for that matter. I don’t understand why you still say I defended these people. I didn’t. I said I don’t want the Mosque built there. This is the grey area between Building the mosque and burning it. Do you understand what I am saying?

  41. Brian says:

    Anthony,
    Different IP address I assure you, meaning I’m not at work. Ask Sabina she’ll tell you. She banned the other one before I left work.
    As far as Cartman being the voice of the “far-right” I think that’s sort of the joke. Do you think any conservative looks at Cartman and is like, “I should vote for that guy” or, I totally agree, all Gingers should be killed.
    No. Come on man. It’s a TV show meant for entertainment. Lighten up and enjoy it. It pokes fun at both sides. It’s not conservative or liberal agenda. It’s anti-agenda and I personally find it hysterical. I still call the community center a Mosque because I feel that’s its ultimate purpose. I know it has pools and what not, but it serves as a gathering place for Muslim-Americans, and I can virtually guarantee you that’s pretty much all who will attend that “community center”. I think you know this too. Maybe it’s not the PC word, but I don’t tend to like PC.
    And when I said Fuck Canada, you’re right. I was out of line, but that has nothing to do with what I feel or whether or not I’m liberal/conservative or whatever you want to believe. It means I got irritated at being called a “whiny-little right-wing bitch”.
    Look she did the same thing, yet you come after me. I know it’s her blog, but why can’t I express my opinions without being lashed out upon and judged?

  42. Oh, fuck off already. When I mentioned the Facebook excerpt, I meant that YOU DID NOT CONDEMN THE ARSONISTS, and that this makes you as extremist as they. Stop twisting my words and own up to your faults, you jackass.
    And no, I don’t have conservative leaning opinions but I’m not an extremist either, so I reject your idiotic characterization of me. I’m a very mainstream leftist, too, at least by Canadian standards. I’ve voted for all three mainstream parties here at one point or another, although I will never vote for another Tory as long as I live. (Or another Liberal, as long as they stay Tory Lite!) I’ve even voted Libertarian–at least, that was before I realized what crazy-ass bag THEY came out of. (Never again–thanks for clearing up my last shred of confusion there, Rand Paul.)
    AND oh yeah: I’m an ex-conservative–how ’bout them apples? I left that shit behind me for a reason: It stank, and I was tired of the stench it left on me.
    Yeah, talk to me again about extremism–WHEN YOU UNDERSTAND THE NATURE OF IT. You clearly do not. You can’t even smell your own!

  43. South Park is “anti-agenda”? Um, no. Its authors are two Libertarians. They have an agenda, and it’s far-right, too. I seem to recall that at least one of them voted for Dubya. (Ugh. Try living THAT down.)
    Actually, if you want ME to take you seriously, here’s a broad hint: Don’t draw your cultural references from a stupid cartoon show. And don’t crib their insults, either. You hurt your cred even more.
    And if you don’t want to be “lashed out upon and judged”, try not being an asshole. How hard is that?

  44. Anthony says:

    Oh please “Brian”, whining about “PC” is just another way of saying “I hate n***ers, but they won’t allow me to use that word”. It’s quite obvious that you are a troll who will sit up ’til 4AM, thinking that you will “win” a flame war on away turf. Just admit that you don’t want us to talk about this; that we should just shut the fuck up, dance after your pipe, and accept that the Free Republic crowd wants to bomb the community center. I don’t think so!
    Also, LOL at your theory that South Park is “apolitical”. I’ve seen several episodes where the designated liberal character (Kyle) is always losing to Cartman in the end, where it concerns politics.

  45. Brian says:

    Sorry, I guess I should’ve read your mind about the facebook excerpt. Oh, and once again, I DO NOT CONDONE THE BOMBING OF THE COMMUNITY CENTER AT ALL, IN FACT I CONDEMN IT. Did the all caps sink in? And you’re honestly saying you don’t have a single conservative belief? Not one? That seems radical. And you’re calling me an extremist when I’m as moderate as they come. Come on now. I’m not conservative and you keep throwing that lable at me. I swear you just want me to be for some reason unbeknownst to me.
    Yes. South park is anti-agenda. It makes fun of whoever or whatever is the “Flavor of the Month”, which I guess could be considered an agenda. Maybe one did vote for Dubya, but would Kerry have been any better? I think not. I don’t draw my cultural references from South Park. If I did you’d be a beady-eyed, head flapping Canadian (PS: How are Terrance and Philip doing?) I’m sorry that things other than CNN and MSNBC are entertaining to me. I find humor in insults, and I know I’m not the only one. Agreed I’m an asshole, but look in the mirror, are you afraid to admit that yourself?

  46. Brian fucking Babylon says:

    Hi again :). Miss me?

  47. Miss you? Not fucking hardly.
    And no, you didn’t have to read my mind, you had to read my POST. And my responses. And exercised a little basic reading comprehension in between. Is that too much to ask? Apparently, yes.
    You may not realize this, but in the US today, “moderate” is way over on the right. Anyone from outside the US can see it. You can’t; that’s fine. Consider this your education for today.
    Would Kerry have been better than Bush? Actually, YES. At least he wasn’t a dumbass warmonger who dodged the Vietnam draft. He knew a thing or two about the futility of foreign wars from his own experience in them. He wasn’t perfect, but nobody was asking that of him. I would have preferred him infinitely, and so would all the rest of the world.
    I don’t know Terrance and Philip, I don’t watch CNN or MSNBC (Fux Snooze Lite? Bleh, waste of money) and I don’t find your insults funny. Boo fucking hoo! Am I supposed to put up with a shithead who tells me to shut my twat? (Do you kiss your wife with that mouth?) That’s not where my thoughts come from. Unlike you, I use my head. (And not for a buttplug, either.)
    And I’m not an asshole; I’m a nice person, actually, who’s had it to the gills with assholes. Especially assholes who are arrogant and ignorant not only about their country’s foreign policy, but the domestic kind too. And who think unfunny insults are a great way to “banter”.
    And I don’t want anything of you, to be honest, except for you to go the hell away and grow the fuck up.
    And on that note, this thread is closed.

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